Broker for systems trading

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hlpsg
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Broker for systems trading

Post by hlpsg » Mon Jun 21, 2004 12:24 am

Hi
I'm looking for a broker to help me auto-trade RMesa5. I was thinking of going with Attain Capital but their charges are very high. However they justify their charges by stating that their orders result in very little slippage especially for day trading, because they use a "Special Execution Desk". For the full report pls see link below:-

http://www.attaincapital.com/alternativ ... an1904.htm

I am not familiar with execution but can see the logic of the article. Would like to find out if there are other good systems brokers out there who also use these special execution desks to get good fills, but charge lower commisions.

Thanks!

Wisdom
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System Assist Broker

Post by Wisdom » Mon Jun 21, 2004 10:42 am

hlpsg,
We would be glad to help you. We've been overseeing customer accounts implementing 3rd party and proprietary trading systems for almost 10 years now. We established Wisdom Financial last year to provide our clients with better rates and more services than we were able to negotiate through Refco and Trade Center, the IB we were formerly a part of.
We can provide you with the experience necessary to implement your trading system flawlessly and offer some of the best rates in the industry.
If you would like a free information package on our company please contact me and we will send it today. I look forward to hearing from you and hope to be of service in the future.
Best regards,
Shane Wisdom
www.wisdomfinancialinc.com
800 854 6354

hlpsg
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Post by hlpsg » Mon Jun 21, 2004 6:35 pm

Hi Shane
Thank you for your response. If you don't mind I would like to hear your views on my original posting (pls see the hyperlink). Basically Attain are able to get good fills on orders because they use these special execution desks. I'm not "in the business" so I do not really know how these orders get processed. But Attain states that between poor fills and high commisions, the trader stands to lose a lot more if he chose to go with poor fills (cheaper commisions), especially for day trading systems like RMesa and Helix. And I have a lot of respect for the folks at Attain although I've never done formal business with them.

As I understand it the use of these special execution desks cost them more so the cost is passed on to the trader. Does your firm also use these so called special execution desks?

It would be a win-win for all to determine the best brokerage firm to use for such system trading, a win for the brokerage firm and also for the trader, so I hope you won't mind discussing this openly.

Thanks for your time!

Wisdom
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Post by Wisdom » Tue Jun 22, 2004 12:28 pm

Hlpsg,
The "special execution" desk they're referring to is also referred to as a "give up" broker. This is a broker that works outside of Refco (their clearing firm) who will attempt to provide better customer service, market information, and fills than Refco may be able to provide. They usually charge a few extra dollars and while there are no guarantees, they can generally do a little better over the long run. However, when news or events hit the market you're always going to be at the mercy of the pit and large slippage can be hard to avoid. Every reputable firm concerned about execution has relationships like this, including us.
The comparison they're showing has a number of factors that are going to affect performance and I'm not sure that the "special execution" desk is the real difference. The executing system brokers knowledge, experience, attention to detail, computer set up, and data are all going to affect performance.
I'm not exactly sure, but I suspect the firm they are comparing their fills against are Strikers. Walter left Striker to form Attain and I imagine he probably took some of his executing talent with him and maintained his give up relationships with the S&P brokers he used at Striker. In looking at the comparisons, Strikers execution appears to have suffered when Walter left or perhaps trade differences due to data could also have played a part.
The comparison they have regarding the large pit traded S&P vs 5 Eminis is flawed in my opinion. The rate for the Emini contracts is not disclosed and I suspect its probably twice what it should be. The liquidity in the Emini is 10x's that of the large contract and if commission costs are kept low fill quality should more than make up for the difference in paying 5x's the commission. Especially for systems that implement stops, like R-mesa.
Thats certainly been our experience and I would be glad to send you our daily fill reports with screenshots for the systems we're executing so you can compare. You can send an email directly to shane@wisdomfinancialinc.com and I'll add you into my address book if you're interested.
Let me know of any other questions that come to mind and how I can help
Best regards,
Shane

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